Social Marketing

Philip Delves Broughton: What they teach you at Harvard?

Editor’s Note: Philip Delves Broughton is the author of The Art of the Sale, published in the UK as Life’s a Pitch, and Ahead of the Curve: Two Years at Harvard Business School, published outside the US as What They Teach You at Harvard Business School. His first book, Ahead of the Curve: Two Years at Harvard Business School was a New York Times bestseller and a Financial Times and USA Today business book of the year.

He spent ten years as a reporter and foreign correspondent with The Daily Telegraph newspaper, serving as its New York and Paris bureau chief. He then left journalism to obtain his MBA at Harvard Business School. He has since worked as a writer at Apple Inc. and the Kauffman Foundation for Entrepreneurship and Education and as a contributing columnist at The Financial Times. His writing has appeared in the Wall Street Journal, The Financial Times and The Atlantic.

eTalk’s Niaz Uddin has interviewed Philip Delves Broughton recently to gain insights about The Art of the Sale, The Greatest Salespeople in the World, The Soul of the Salesman, What They Teach You at Harvard and The Point of a Business Education which is given below.

Niaz: Dear Philip, thank you so much for managing time to join us amidst your busy schedule. We are honored to have you at eTalks.

Philip: My pleasure.

Niaz: You are the New York Times best selling author, blogger, business philosopher, speaker and an inspiring mind. Your books ‘The Art of the Sale‘ and ‘What they teach you at Harvard Business School‘ are truly instrumental for self-help, self-growth and for the success in 21st century. At the very beginning of our interview can you please tell us more about you, your work and your current involvements?

Philip: I grew up in England, was a newspaper journalist and foreign correspondent for the first ten years of my career, then decided to go to business school at Harvard. Since then, I’ve written and published three books, the memoir of going to HBS, The Art of the Sale, and a book called Management Matters, which is basically a collection of the pieces on management I’ve written for the Financial Times. I write regularly for the FT, the Wall Street Journal and am affiliated with the Kauffman Foundation for Entrepreneurship and Education, a wonderful institution based in Kansas City which funds a wide array of programs designed to stimulate entrepreneurship.

Niaz: Why are you very passionate about ‘Sale’? Can you please tell us what exactly is Sale?

Philip: Sales is very simply the process of turning a product or service into revenue. I’m fascinated by it, because as one great salesman told me, it’s the greatest laboratory there is for understanding human behavior. In sales, we see business at its most raw. We see the truth, lies, greed, decency, ambition and value of any business and business person exposed at the moment of the sale.

Niaz: As you know social media revolution, cutting edge technology, disruptive innovation, widespread uses of smartphone and a whole new digital world have been changing everything. This trend is bringing revolutionary change in the way we do business. Living in such an exciting era, what’s new about sale now in comparison to sale 15-20 years back?

Philip: There’s evidently much more transparency. It’s much harder to deceive customers in a world where so much information about products and pricing is available at a keystroke. Reputation has become far more important as it can so easily be damaged in a world of viral reviews. Transactions have also changed. We can buy and sell in so many different ways these days. Social networks have certainly made prospecting for customers and checking on people’s reputation easier. But I still believe real, lasting relationships require in-person contact over time. Technology hasn’t changed that.

Niaz: Can you please tell us about the art and science of selling?

Philip: The science is in creating value around your product and service and then finding ways to convey that value to the right customers. It’s about mapping your product and sales process to their needs and schedules, not your own. The art is in having a supple, imaginative grasp of human behavior. It’s about finding the right balance between science and intuition, because it’s still the case that humans make decisions, and technology, though vastly improved, is still far from being a complete substitute for human intelligence in sales.

Niaz: You have cited, ‘Without a sale, there is no business’. We have seen, most companies fail only because they can’t make enough sale even though some of them are using state of the art technologies, are embracing science and disruptive innovation and despite they have great products. Sometimes customers don’t want the products and most of the time they fail to make sale. As a result the success rate is very little and almost 90% Start Ups fail. Why art and science of selling remain necessary to succeed in most of the human business disciplines? Why is sale the core part of any business?

Philip: Sales is often the last thing many people like to do, because it’s the final judgment on their product or service. It’s a moment of truth. At the moment you sell, you’re risking rejection, which can be painful. Smart, highly educated people in particular aren’t used to rejection, and so try to minimize the risk of it. Sales isn’t forgiving. But if you don’t sell and earn a profit, you’re pursuing a hobby not a business. I often hear people try to make a virtue of their reluctance to sell. They say they’re not aggressive or bullying enough. Or that they don’t like asking people for money. But really, all they are is bad at sales. If you can’t sell yourself, or hire or partner with someone who can, you have no business being in business. It’s not a very complicated concept. The flip side is that people who do push through the rejections and difficulties which precede almost any sale, find their eventual success a great rush which they want to repeat as often as possible. Those people tend to be the ones who succeed in business.

Niaz: Do you think sale is the advanced human game? What are your suggestions on mastering this advanced game?

Philip: I’m not sure how advanced it is, but it can certainly be viewed as a game between consenting adults. There’s an old Quaker tradesman’s saying I cite in the book ‘I shall not cheat thee, but I shall outwit thee.’ I think this is a useful moral code for any salesperson. Ideally, your product, service and price perfectly match a customer’s need and willingness to pay and the sale is easy. But most of the time you’ll need to do some modifying, persuading and course correcting to close a deal. If you lie, you’ll likely end up being exposed. But you can certainly out-think and out-strategize to win, while balancing the short and long-term consequences of your actions. People have very different comfort levels about what they’re willing to do to sell. But good salespeople, however they choose to do it, have thought the compromises and risks and have set firm boundaries on their behavior.

Niaz: What do you think about the salesmanship of Steve Jobs? How has he become one of the greatest salespeople in the world? What are the characteristics, views, ideas, skills and insights of Salesmanship of Steve Jobs that fascinate you?

Philip: Jobs was indistinguishable from his products. He never ceded the role of Apple’s chief salesman to anyone else. That’s a very powerful model and the way he did it inspired enormous belief in his company and products. He used the language of religious evangelism, such as “transformation” and “magic”. He also made brilliant use of persuasive techniques such as “social proof”. All those glass windows in Apple stores allow passers by to see people like themselves using Apple products. The “I’m a Mac, I’m a PC” ads similarly made the case that buying Apple products wasn’t just above buying software or hardware. It cut to the very heart of your social identity. It’s rather creepy, actually, but Jobs was brilliant at it. It’s easy to forget what a marginal company Apple was in 1997, when Jobs returned as CEO. His salesmanship helped turn the company around internally by restoring belief among employees, and then got customers to try the products at at time when Wintel was still dominant.

Niaz: Were there some universal qualities you found in great sales people?

Philip: An optimistic frame of mind, enthusiasm, self-discipline, the ability to tell a story and to be energized rather than crushed by rejection. They are terrific listeners, but also ruthless closers. They also tend to be very good company, which made writing about them such fun.

Niaz: Despite the new opportunities in social media, marketing and measurement, selling still frequently comes down to two people looking each other in the eye and deciding how to sell and whether to buy. Business continues to need great salespeople along with all the creativity, tenacity and optimism they bring. Great salespeople come in very different packages. Some are the best at high volume transactional selling and others thrive at building long-term relationships. At this point can you please tell us about the great skills of 21st century salespeople?

Philip: They’re the same as they’ve always been. You need to keep abreast of the prospecting and pitching tools, such as LinkedIn and Salesforce, but ultimately the edge still belongs to those able to build trust, inspire repeat customers and develop healthy books of business. Maybe there’ll be fewer steak and cigar dinners in the 21st century, but you still have to find ways to develop meaningful relationships and that doesn’t happen virtually. Personal networks and interpersonal skills will count as much as ever.

Niaz: What happens when the business and non-business worlds no longer understand each other?

Philip: Revolution.

Niaz: You have had said ‘The cleverest invention or product will disappear — creating no income, no employment — unless someone can sell it.’ Is sale resided in the core of capitalism? How does sales drive economy?

Philip: If all an economy consisted of was things we needed simply to survive, it would look very primitive. No one needs a BMW or a Jamba Juice, or a Macbook or a work of art. But such things make life more appealing. Profit incentives are also essential to the creation of more important things such as new medical treatments or healthier cities. It’s by selling each other new, interesting and life-enhancing, rather than just life-sustaining, that economies grow. Sales leads to revenue leads to profit leads to investment leads to growth.

Niaz: Do you think by creating better understanding of selling, and the many challenges it involves, we can build better world? How can that become possible if I want you to discuss from removing poverty to solving international fights, solving environment problems to stop international war?

Philip: This a long way above my pay grade! All that counts here is that we continue to search for the healthiest balance between market forces and social justice. It’s a constant adjustment for all of us. As individuals, we struggle with our material, emotional and spiritual desires. Companies must balance shareholder with employee interests. Governments seek a way to grow national economies while protecting the weakest in their societies. Sales matters in all this because, as I said, it cuts right to the heart of these discussions. How we choose to sell says everything about how we’re balancing the good and bad in our selves.

Niaz: In 2004, you gave up a career in journalism to attend Harvard Business School. Three years later, you published the New York Times bestseller ‘Ahead of the Curve: Two Years at Harvard Business School’, in which you described and questioned the value of a business education. You have cited ‘Most top business schools don’t teach selling’. And you believe ‘Selling should be the first thing to teach, as everything in business flows from the sale’. Can you please tell us about the point of a business education? What’s going wrong with our business education?

Philip: A business education should enable someone to pursue their interests in a way that makes good financial sense. A lot of MBA programs charge a lot of money while under-delivering on this basic purpose. I also think the top business programs need to do a better job educating students on the social purpose of business. Better basics, more humility and lower fees would go a long way to fixing this.

Niaz: Still folks from different countries, states and cities across the world hope that teaching business and entrepreneurship will lead to initiate more start-ups and better businesses. Is their hope justified?

Philip: Education is always a good thing. But I think the teaching of business and entrepreneurship can be pretty crude and ineffective and there’s a lot of work to do in improving it. Also, it’s not just about educating individual entrepreneurs. The social and political context also has to favor them.

Niaz: Can you please tell us about the aspects of business which can and cannot be taught, those which must be taught better, and those are not worth teaching at all?

Philip: Sales, evidently, should be more a part of MBA curricula. I’m intrigued by new just-in-time business education programs, which deliver teaching at the moment a businessperson needs it. That seems to make a lot of sense. The issue here isn’t what should or should not be taught at a high level. It’s about delivering value to the person who needs it. Business isn’t law or medicine, with a body of knowledge which has to be learned before you can practice. It’s much more fluid than that, and business education needs to reflect this fact.

Niaz: How educators and policy-makers should teach business as a means to improving the rate and quality of economic growth?

Philip: Focus on developing communities of businesspeople. Help facilitate connections. Listen to what these people ask for. Then get out of the way.

Niaz: What are you doing now at The Kauffman Foundation for Entrepreneurship and Education?

Philip: Writing about entrepreneurship programs, what works, what doesn’t.

Niaz: Thanks a lot for joining and sharing us your great ideas, insights and knowledge. We are wishing you good luck for all of your upcoming great endeavors. Happy New Year Philip.

Philip: Thanks Niaz.

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Further Reading:

01. Philip Kotler on Marketing for Better World

02. Hugh Mac­Leod on Creativity and Art

03. Daniel Pink on To Sell is Human

04. Naeem Zafar on Entrepreneurship for the Better World

05. Derek Sivers on  Entrepreneurship, CD Baby and Wood Egg

06. Jeff Haden on Pursuing Excellence

07. Rita McGrath on Strategy in Volatile and Uncertain Environments

08. Gautam Mukunda on Leadership

09. Gerd Leonhard on Big Data and the Future of Media, Marketing and Technology

Naeem Zafar: Entrepreneurship for the Better World

Editor’s Note: Naeem Zafar is the president and CEO of Bitzer Mobile, a company that simplifies enterprise mobility. On November 15, 2013 Oracle announced it has acquired Bitzer Mobile. As a member of the faculty of the Haas Business School at the University of California Berkeley, he teaches Entrepreneurship and Innovation in the MBA program. He is the founder of Startup-Advisor, which focuses on educating and advising entrepreneurs on all aspects of starting and running a company. His entrepreneurial experience includes working directly with six startups, and he has extensive experience in mentoring and coaching founders and CEOs.

Mr. Zafar holds a Bachelor of Science degree in electrical engineering from Brown University (magna cum laude), Rhode Island, and a master’s degree in electrical engineering from the University of Minnesota. He is a charter member of TiE .He is also a charter member of OPEN where he serves as the Board member.

You can read his full bio from here, here and here.

eTalk’s Niaz Uddin has interviewed Naeem Zafar recently to gain his ideas and insights about StartUp, social business and entrepreneurship for better world which is given below.

Q: You’re a successful entrepreneur. As a member of faculty of the Haas Business School at UC Berkeley, you teach entrepreneurship and innovation in the MBA program. At the beginning of our interview can you please tell us what exactly is entrepreneurship?

A: Entrepreneurship is a state of mind. It is a way to look at a situation and see how could you make a profitable venture out of it. It is very innate. People, educated or not in urban or rural setting, are just as likely to spot an opportunity and drive it to commercialization.  The likelihood is there just as it is for a Silicon Valley hotshot startup guy. So it transcends all boundaries of education, race and gender. It is a state of mind.

Q: You believe that entrepreneurship can be a powerful tool to alleviate poverty and extremism of the world and social businesses can fill the gap where public institutions often fall short. Can you please tell us more about that?

A: If you think about the definition of a business….its objective is to maximize shareholder return. So the shareholder who invests in the company has an expectation that the management should do whatever it can to maximize return; that is perfectly fine. We have seen tremendous companies and innovation come out of that model. But if there were a concept of setting up a company with the sole purpose of not  maximizing shareholders return but to address its social ill….. that can work for alleviating poverty.

It can be something as simple as the city doing lousy job of collecting garbage. Let’s say the garbage is not being collected on time which is very unpleasant as we know. We can set up a company so that there speedy pick up and disposal of garbage. The purpose of that company is to address this social ill. It is not to maximize shareholder profit. Imagine setting up the company with that objective and shareholders putting in money. This company’s objective is for this social ill to be addressed and not to maximize profit. Now, it is still a for profit company. It still pays market wages and hires the best people to address the issue but it is not trying to maximize profit.

This model which can be very rewarding for the shareholders as it is a new way of looking at solving many of the problems which governments are not well suited to solve. That’s called social business. I think the concept is a powerful one. It’s put forward by the Nobel laureate, Muhammad Yunus, in his 3rd book and I think it is a tremendous way for communities to organize and address issues which plagued them without having to wait for government to show up.

Q: How do you connect these three dots: social entrepreneurship, alleviating poverty and making a better world?

A: If you look at my previous answer I just connected the three dots for you.  Making a better world is about alleviating poverty and giving people a chance to participate in economic growth and well-being. Social businesses and entrepreneurship is a way for them to have that opportunity.

In the country that I grew up in you look for government to give you a good job. However, the government is not well equipped to provide a job for everybody. On the other hand, the private sector is well positioned. As we have seen in US, the private sector produced even submarines, bombs and fighter jets. This was quite shocking to me when I came to this country.

The government’s job is not to produce goods. Its job is to set policies and systems so that companies and entrepreneurs can thrive.

Q: How did you find the idea for Bitzer Mobile? Can you please briefly tell us about Bitzer Mobile?

A: Bitzer Mobile’s technical founder, Ali Ahmed, was working as a software architect for large companies in insurance and oil verticals for many years. He continued to recognize that people were struggling to allow employees mobile access to data.

Ali was having to solve the problem for every company in a unique way. So the idea was, why not come up with the way so that the employees can easily and securely access corporate data and be productive from wherever they happen to be. And that gave birth to Bitzer.

Q: As far as I believe for changing the world, we need to find complex, interesting  and  big problems of the world and then have to build great organizations that will sustain in the long run to keep solving those problems as well as to keep contributing for the betterment of the mother earth. Can you please tell us how can we find interesting, complex and big problems of this world?

A: First of all, I don’t agree with your definition. It is not about solving big problems. It is about solving problems. Problems of all sizes. Sometimes all you have to do is look around you. There are problems in your community, where you live, where you work. Solve those problems. Big ideas come from people trying to solve small problems which turn into great movements. So looking for the great problems to solve is not the only way and may not be most efficient way to do it either.

Q: What are your suggestions on finding interesting ideas and bringing the ideas to life to solve?

A: Interesting ideas to solve come from deep domain knowledge. It’s very difficult for entrepreneurs when they are young to come up with ideas as they can be light weight. The average age of an entrepreneur in America is 37. This means that many people are older than 37 when they start their company. So only if you worked in the industry for 5-10 years you really understand what issues are, what the problems are, and then you can see how you can solve them. So my advice is:  look around you, work in some industry, learn the hard skills. Then you will see the problem and you will be well equipped to solve them. This is how you address this issue.

Q: What are your takes on finding the right business model and identifying early customers?

A: To find the right business model and early customers is simple. You should be able to answer these two fundamental questions: what problem are you solving and who has this problem.  If you cannot concisely answer these two questions you don’t have clarity in your head. I insist that people should talk to 5 to 10 actual users and buyers of whatever product they’re planning to buy and try to understand what their pain is. If you cannot clearly articulate what pain your customers have do not start the company. Then discuss with customers what you are planning to do and if this would be interested in it. If you cannot generate this early customer interest, do not start the company.

And stop worrying about confidentiality. People have other problems to solve in their lives. They are not running to copy your idea. It is the execution of your idea that is the hard part. By bouncing these ideas off suitable customers and users and consistently getting positive feedback, you may be in a position to start the company and then they likely will buy it. Everything else will clarify itself during the course of this process.

Q: Can you please tell us about the legal process of starting a company?

A: Legal process depends on in which country you are starting the company in, what the local regulations are.  My book which is a legal guide for entrepreneurs goes into fair amount of details: What is the process, what options you have in the United States. So read the book. It’s available at naeemzafar.com.

Q: As you’ve seen during Internet bubble, there were so many companies founded and were committed to change the world. But with the changes of time around 90% of them got obsolete. And we ended up having some great companies. Now, there are also so many startups working with cloud computing, big data, wearable technologies, space, robotics and so on. The data shows most of them will also get obsolete as the success rate of startups is very low. But there are always some common characteristics, values,  philosophies and ideas that  keep some startups alive and helps to sustain in the long run. You have profound experience of seeing all the trends as you have been advising companies and working with great entrepreneurs in Silicon Valley. What are your suggestions on building the next big organization?

A: Aspect of building the next big organization is about solving a big problem. It is easy to spot what are the problems that need to be solved. All the trends you mention have tremendous potential.

Big data and business analytics can pinpoint precisely if you put a restaurant in the corner of this street and that street. They tell you what will be your monthly sales when you put it in the corner of that street and that street. So, the way businesses will be making decision could be based on not intuition but actual data.

If you read the book or watch the movie called Moneyball, it is about applying statistics to baseball. It is about how a mediocre team became the number one team by using big data. And that is applicable to every single business. So look for a big idea around you and build a great team with high caliber people. If you can put together a right market with the right team, you can build a lasting company too.

Q: How do you think about hiring remarkable people and let them scope to work on achieving vision that will change our world for good?

A: I think it’s good idea to hire remarkable people. You should do that. It’s not easy to do that. Remember the good people  will follow somebody which they can respect and whose vision they share. If you don’t have the passion and vision yourself why would A people, A players, best players follow you. Best players want to follow someone that they believe in. If you have that you shall attract the right team. And yes, you will be able to do great things. So step up to the stage and stage could be yours.

Q:  Whenever we talk about changing the world, thing that always comes first is changing ourselves. After changing our own life, we can go and change our family, then our society and then our country and then we can have a mission of changing the world to make it a better place to live in. But changing the world is hard, complex, challenging and hurting. You have come a long way and have already left a body of works to make this  world a bit more special. Can you please tell us about what your life has thought you in this amazing journey?

A: What my life has taught me is that it’s not a sprint. It is a marathon. So you have to create your own brand. You have to be genuine and honest and people will follow you . If you have  a vision that attracts people, you will have easy time attracting them.

So my advice to myself and other people around me is that if you’re a genuine person and a truthful person and you have a strong vision and can articulate it, you will have people willing to follow you. Once you have people willing to follow you then there is no challenge you cannot take tackle, no matter how big it is.

You will be able to overcome it over time and there are plenty of problems to follow around the world. But be true to yourself and always look for the team who is willing to follow you.

Q:  Last but not least, can you please give some advice to entrepreneurs who are on the mission of changing the world?

A: Changing the world is important and changing the world sometimes happens. But that is not the goal to start with. It is too big goal. It is too audacious and maybe even too arrogant to have this goal.

Martin Luther King did not have the goal of changing the world. He was just trying to change some laws so that black people could have equal rights. When Steve Jobs was starting Apple he wanted to do a music iPod. He was not trying to change the world. So I’m a little bit suspicious of your question because changing the world has come up multiple times.  Forget about changing the world. Do something meaningful for the people around you and your community. If you’re lucky enough it will have a big impact.  So think more practical and try to make local change. Stop worrying about changing the world – that will come later if you’re so lucky.

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Further Reading:

1. Peter Klein on Entrepreneurship, Economics and Education

2. Derek Sivers on  Entrepreneurship, CD Baby and Wood Egg

3. F. M. Scherer on Industrial Economy, Digital Economy and Innovation

4. Diego Comin on Entrepreneurship, Technology and Global Economic Development

5. Stephen Walt on Global Development

6. Juliana Rotich on Social Entrepreneurial Innovation

Jillian C. York: Freedom of Expression, Social Media and Nonprofits

Editor’s Note: Jillian C. York is Director for International Freedom of Expression at the Electronic Frontier Foundation. Before joining the EFF, York worked at Harvard’s Berkman Center for Internet & Society, where she contributed to the OpenNet Initiative. Her work is at the intersection of technology and policy, with a focus on the Arab world. She is a frequent public speaker and has written for a variety of publications, including the New York Times, Al Jazeera, the Atlantic, the Guardian, Global Voice, Foreign PolicySlate and CNN.  With Katherine Maher, she has a regular web show, Interrobang, hosted on Bloggingheads.tv.

Jillian contributed chapters to the upcoming volumes Beyond WikiLeaks: Implications for the Future of Communication, Journalism and Society (Palgrave Macmillan) and State Power 2.0: Authoritarian Entrenchment and Political Engagement Worldwide (Ashgate Publishing).  She serves on the Board of Directors of Global Voices Online, and on the Advisory Boards of R-Shief, Radio Free Asia’s Open Technology Fund, and Internews’ Global Internet Policy Project.

She says “I talk a lot around the Internets, and in real life–about free expression, privacy, anonymity, culture, and MENA.  I also talk about travel and post pictures of food.” You can get her on Twitter, LinkedIn and Google +.

To read her full bio please click here, here, here and here.

eTalk’s Niaz Uddin has interviewed Jillian C. York recently to gain her ideas and insights on Freedom of Expression, Social Media and Nonprofits which is given below.

Niaz: Dear Jillian, thank you so much for joining us in the midst of your busy schedule. We are very thrilled and honored to have you at eTalks.

Jillian:  Thank you for having me.

Niaz: As an activist, you have been working with all great organizations and setting a trend of doing great works. You’re also a writer and a speaker. At the beginning of our interview can you please tell us more about yourself, current works, projects and involvements?

Jillian: Certainly.  Right now, I’m working on some really interesting projects.  One is an effort to create a set of educational resources to teach people how to be more safe online…there are a lot of great guides and tools out there, but many of them are difficult to understand, or the resources are scattered all over the web.  We want to create a definitive set of resources that are easy to access and comprehend.

Another thing I’m working on with my colleagues is pushing governments to commit to a set of 13 principles for the application of human rights to communications surveillance (they’re at necessaryandproportionate.net).  We’ve gotten more than 300 organizations all over the world to sign on, and dozens of academics and experts, too.  Now we’re taking these principles to governments.

Niaz: You’re the Director for International Freedom of Expression at the Electronic Frontier Foundation. Can you please briefly tell us about EFF, it’s activities and vision?

Jillian:  EFF was born in 1990 in response to a basic threat to speech.  Since then, the organization has grown to encompass a variety of issues—free speech, privacy, intellectual property, open access—that face us in the digital realm.

In the United States, much of our work is done in the courtroom, but we also have a strong team of activists who raise our issues in Washington, DC and get support from all over the country and the world.  Our technology team builds tools and advises people and organizations on security.  And our international team, the team that I work with, works with organizations all over the world to create good policy, fight online threats, and help build a movement in favor of online free speech and privacy.

Niaz: What are the other organizations out there working for freedom of expressions?  Do you think we should have more organization in this area?

Jillian: There are so many!  There are global organizations like Access and Global Voices Advocacy and US-focused organizations like Free Press and Fight for the Future.  There are organizations all over the globe that I love and support, too…just to name a few, there’s Bolo Bhi in Pakistan, La Quadrature du Net in France, Derechos Digitales in Chile, 7iber in Jordan, MADA in Palestine, Digitale Gesellschaft in Germany, and so many more!

Niaz: How building similar organizations from different parts of world can help EFF to achieve its amazing vision? What are your messages for the youngsters working in nonprofits?

Jillian: Fundamentally, we believe in certain ideals, but we also believe that those battles are best won by local organizations, rather than by a US organization like ours coming in and trying to fix problems.  And so our strategy is to work in partnerships with organizations in other countries to help them build capacity or support them in their fight against a particular threat.  Of course, in this process, we also learn so much from our colleagues everywhere.

My message to youngsters would be that it’s worthwhile to do what you’re passionate about.  I’ve spent my entire career working in the nonprofit sector, and have found it incredibly rewarding.  It helps too that, through my job, I’ve developed friendships all over the world, which means I always have a place to sleep wherever I am!

Niaz: You also serve on the Board of Directors of Global Voices Online. It has already become a true Global Media where people from all over the world doing citizen journalism and sharing amazing stories in different languages. At this point, can you please tell us about citizen journalism? How has citizen journalism been changing our traditional media?

Jillian: The problem that I have with traditional media is that it’s limited.  In the US, it’s limited by the (false) idea of “objectivity”, but also by the experience of its journalists.  I don’t think mainstream media is or should be dead, far from it, rather, I think that citizen journalism provides a supplement to more traditional media.  It helps us gain the human perspective of a story.

Niaz: How is Global Voices different from other traditional media? Why is it important to be different?

Jillian: Global Voices began as an attempt to cover what people were saying in the blogospheres of places where the mainstream media didn’t always reach.  Since that time, a lot has changed: we can now access more mainstream publications from different places in the world, giving us an insight into the perspectives of journalists there.  There is also a lot more content from certain places in English than there was a decade ago, which is helpful.

Today, Global Voices still seeks to accomplish that goal, but it’s also now available in dozens of languages, which I often think is even more valuable – it allows people in Madagascar, for example, to read content in their own language by and about people in say, Venezuela or Japan.  It’s that cross-cultural pollination that I find fascinating.

Global Voices is also unique in that it’s almost entirely run by volunteers.  There are fewer than 10 paid full-time employees, and more than 300 people working on the project at any time.

Niaz: Your work focuses on freedom of expression.  And you’ve a profound body of works on freedom of expression. Now can you please tell us about Internet Censorship? How does Internet Censorship affect freedom of expression as well as democracy?

Jillian: Censorship happens all over the world.  We often hear about China and Iran, which are by far two of the worst offenders, but we hear much less about the Internet censorship that happens in Vietnam, Jordan, and many other places.  In Vietnam, political content is censored and bloggers that challenge the state can be arrested for unrelated crimes.  In Jordan, more than 300 news websites were recently blocked after they refused to obtain licenses.  Censorship can be used for all sorts of purposes, but governments that censor the Internet tend to have one thing in common: they fear their citizens.

Niaz: Social media coverage is becoming increasingly common across media; do you see a fundamental shift happening in the way news is covered, particularly internationally?

Jillian: I do – I’m seeing a lot more agency given to the subjects of news articles.  It used to be that an American journalist could parachute in, write a story about a place, and have that story become the definitive narrative of a given situation.  Today, the Internet allows the “subjects” of that narrative to challenge it.  So when, for example, Tom Friedman writes a story about Egypt, you will often see Egyptians on Twitter challenging him about it.

Unfortunately, this is happening on the fringe of the media.  The Atlantic, for example, is doing a pretty good job of it, but the New York Times by and large still seems fairly oblivious.

Niaz: What do you think about social media revolution in terms of freedom of expression?

Jillian: I think that we’re looking at a net positive for freedom of expression, but with a serious caveat: the social media companies that host our speech can also exercise control over it.  This can be insidious, such as Facebook banning entire categories of expression (such as nudity or its ill-defined “hate speech”), but it can also be subtler.  We should be cautious and aware of the fact that the spaces we think of as the online public sphere are not public at all, but privately-owned companies.

Niaz: Do you think social media revolution is also the revolution of free speech? What do you think about the future of Citizen Media that will be able to scale freedom of expression?

Jillian: Yes and no.  I think that the social media revolution is about broadening the set of voices we can hear and that we listen to, but I don’t think we’re nearly there in terms of access to call this a speech revolution.  There are places in the world, like Yemen, where Internet penetration still rests below 5% of a country’s population, and there are other places, like Nigeria, where women report not feeling safe accessing public Internet spaces.  We need to solve the access gap before we can really proclaim social media as a revolution of free speech.

Niaz: What’s new about democracy in this digital era? How do you connect democracy, freedom of expression and social media revolution?

Jillian: I’m not sure we’re even close to solving the problems of democracy, but I do believe that social media opens up space for citizens to make their voices heard in an unprecedented way.  Take, for example, the recent nuclear deal between the US and Iran.  I watched while right-wing journalists decried the deal on Twitter, but their voices were drowned out by those of the people, the citizens, all over the world.  Before social media, those “expert” voices would’ve carried far more weight than they do now.

Niaz: Can you please tell us about your book chapter in the volume ‘State Power 2.0’?

Jillian: Sure – I wrote this chapter with Katherine Maher.  It covers the history of the Tunisian Internet—its infrastructure, censorship, surveillance—as well as the forces that led to a change in policies after the fall of Ben Ali.

Niaz: What are your suggestions to make our non-profit sector much more productive, scalable, efficient and effective?

Jillian: I think one of the key challenges is for non-profit organizations to think more like businesses, particularly when it comes to finding sustainable funding models.  Non-profits are all too often tied to foundations, which means they risk losing their funding at any moment.  We’re lucky in the United States, in that donations are tax-deductible, which means that organizations have a much easier time at getting individual support.

Niaz: Can you please briefly tell us about your new book ‘Beyond WikiLeaks: Implications for the Future of Communications, Journalism & Society?

Jillian: Sure – this is a fantastic book put together by a group of academics. My chapter looks at the history and effects of leaking in the Arab world, starting with the Iran-Contra Affair and moving toward the future.

Niaz: Dear Jillian, thank you very much for your invaluable time and also for sharing us your amazing life story, great ideas, insights, experience and knowledge. We are wishing you very good luck for your good health and safe living along with for all of your upcoming great endeavors.

Jillian:  Thank you so much, Niaz, this has been great.

_  _  _  _  ___  _  _  _  _

Further Reading:

1. Stephen Walt on Global Development

2. Juliana Rotich on Social Entrepreneurial Innovation

3. Shaka Senghor on Writing My Wrongs

4. Ovick Alam on BridgeWee

5. Shaba Binte Amin on Poverty Fighter Foundation

Robert Stavins: Environmental Economics

Editor’s Note: Robert Stavins is the Albert Pratt Professor of Business and Government, Director of the Harvard Environmental Economics Program, Chairman of the Environment and Natural Resources Faculty Group at the John F. Kennedy School of Government, Harvard University, and Director of Graduate Studies for the Doctoral Program in Public Policy and the Doctoral Program in Political Economy and Government, and Co-Chair of the  Harvard Business School-Kennedy School Joint Degree Programs, and Director of the Harvard Project on Climate Agreements.

To read his full bio, please visit here, here and here.

eTalk’s Niaz Uddin has interviewed Robert Stavins recently to gain insights about Environmental Economics which is given below.

Niaz: Dear Robert, thank you so much for joining us in the midst of your busy schedule. We are so honored to have you at eTalks.

R. Stavins: Thanks for having me Niaz.

Niaz: You are one of the most influential voices in environmental economics and the field of environmental economics is more important than ever.  At the beginning of our interview, can you please tell us about environmental economics?

R. Stavins: In a market economy – the form of economic system that is now found in nearly all countries of the world – the cause of environmental problems are fundamentally economic, namely the fact that environmental pollution is an externality, a negative, unintended consequence of economic activity, whether carried out by individuals or firms.  In addition, the consequences of environmental problems have important economic dimensions.  For these two reasons, economics and economic analysis provide an exceptionally useful lens through which to examine environmental problems, so that they are fully understood, and so that as a result public policies can be designed which are environmentally effective, economically sensible, and therefore more likely to be politically pragmatic.

Over the past two decades, environmental economics has evolved from what was once a relatively obscure application of welfare economics to a prominent field of economics in its own right.  The number of articles on the natural environment appearing in mainstream economics periodicals has continued to increase, as has the number of economics journals dedicated exclusively to environmental and resource topics.  Likewise, the influence of environmental economics on public policy has increased significantly, particularly as greater use has been made of market-based instruments for environmental protection.

Niaz: Do you think environmental economics is conflicting with capitalism or market economy? Why or why not?

R. Stavins: At first blush, many people think of the phrase “environmental economics” as oxymoronic – an internal contradiction – since it’s either the economy or the environment.  Although there are typically trade-offs between environmental protection and narrowly-defined economic well-being (i.e., financial well-being), for the reasons I stated above, environmental economics is not an internal contradiction, but rather an effective discipline with which to study the performance of proposed and implemented environmental policies.

Niaz: What are the distinctive perspectives of environmental economics that make it the next big thing for entrepreneurs, innovators, economists as well as researchers?

R. Stavins: Given the threat of global climate change, which will bring seriously economic damages when it occurs and which will require significant economic sacrifices to mitigate, an environmental economic perspective is increasingly important for a broad range of sectors in private industry.

Niaz: Dear Robert thanks again for finding time in the midst of your busy schedule.

R. Stavins: You’re welcome Niaz.

_  _  _  _  ___  _  _  _  _

Further Reading:

1. Peter Klein on Entrepreneurship, Economics and Education

2. Derek Sivers on  Entrepreneurship, CD Baby and Wood Egg

3. F. M. Scherer on Industrial Economy, Digital Economy and Innovation

4. Diego Comin on Entrepreneurship, Technology and Global Economic Development

5. Stephen Walt on Global Development

6. Juliana Rotich on Social Entrepreneurial Innovation

7. Naeem Zafar on Entrepreneurship for the Better World

Daniel Pink: To Sell is Human

Editor’s Note: Daniel Pink is the author of five provocative books– including the long-running New York Times bestsellers, A Whole New Mindand Drive.His latest book, To Sell is Human, is a #1 New York Times business bestseller, a #1 Wall Street Journal business bestseller, and a #1 Washington Post nonfiction bestseller. Dan’s books have been translated into 34 languages. His articles on business and technology appear in many publications, including the New York Times, Harvard Business Review, Fast Company, Wired, and The Sunday Telegraph (See a sample of articles here).

His TED Talk ‘The puzzle of motivation‘ has almost 6 millions views and RSA Animate Talk ‘The surprising truth about what motivates us‘ has more than 10 millions views. Dan has provided analysis of business trends on CNN, CNBC, ABC, NPR, and other networks in the U.S. and abroad. And he lectures to corporations, associations, and universities around the world on economic transformation and the new workplace.

In 2011, Thinkers50 ranked him one of the 50 most influential business thinkers in the world. To read his full bio, please click here, here and here.

eTalk’s Niaz Uddin has interviewed Daniel Pink recently to gain insights about Conceptual Age, To Sell is Human, Art and Design which is given below.

Niaz: Dear Dan, thank you so much for joining us. We are very honored to have you at eTalks.

Dan Pink: My pleasure.

Niaz: As you know, we have been living through the agricultural, industrial, and information ages. According to you, we are now living in a conceptual age. At the beginning of our interview, can you please tell us about ‘Conceptual Age’?

Dan Pink: We are leaving the Information Age — an economy and a society built on logical, linear, computer-like capabilities — and entering an economy and a society build on inventive, empathic, big-picture capabilities — the Conceptual Age. The defining skills of the Information Age — what I call “left brain” capabilities — are still necessary, but to them we need to add “right brain” aptitudes and qualities. In A WHOLE NEW MIND, I identify six essential aptitudes for the new age: Design, Story, Symphony, Empathy, Play, and Meaning.

Niaz: You say, in today’s world, we are all sales people. Your most recent book ‘To Sell is Human’ has become New York Times, Wall Street Journal’s and Washington Posts’ Best Seller. We must comprehend now, whoever we are, whatever we do and wherever we belong, we do sell. Why do you believe ‘To sell is Human’?

To Sell Is Humna

Dan Pink: Like it or not, we’re all in sales now — whether we have sales in our job title or not. But sales isn’t what it used to be. We’ve moved from a world of information asymmetry (sellers have lots more information than buyers) to one of information parity (sellers and buyers are more evenly matched). And that has nudged us from a world of “buyer beware” to one of “seller beware.” Selling effectively — whether it’s your idea or your product or yourself– in a world of seller beware depends on three key qualities: Attunement (taking another’s perspective); Buoyancy (staying afloat in an ocean of rejection); and Clarity (moving from accessing information to curating it and from solving existing problems to identifying new problems.) I talk about these qualities keeping in mind the skills you need to become more effective at selling, but in the end I hope that what this book shows is that selling is more important, more urgent, and more beautiful than we realize. The capacity to sell isn’t some unnatural adaptation to the merciless world of commerce. It’s part of who we are.

Niaz: You’ve said that abundance changes the way we see material goods. We no longer just want to have things; we want cool things. We want well-designed things. We want things with a meaning. On the other hand, you’ve also said that the new master of business administration is the master of fine arts. Why do you think art and design are the next big things?

Dan Pink: We live in a world of such abundance and prosperity that, for businesses, it’s no longer enough to make a product that’s reasonably priced and adequately functional. It must also be beautiful, unique, and meaningful. Design – the marriage of utility and significance – has become an essential aptitude for personal fulfillment and professional success in the Conceptual Age.

Niaz: As you know, so many of us now want to contribute amazing things to make this world a better place. We also see people want to change the world to make it a bit more special. In reality, it is so tough to change the world. But having a wish to change the world is really appreciating and great. Can you please tell us about the top most problems of this planet which has to be considered greatly to make this world a better place?

Dan Pink: The general story of humankind is a slow (and often unsteady) march toward progress. If you look back from today, things are much better for most people than they were 100 years ago, let alone 500 years ago. That’s not to say we don’t have contemporary challenges. Here in the U.S., I’d put two issues at the top:

1. Our economy is increasingly leaving a slice of our population behind, marooning them without meaningful work or a sense of hope;

2. Our government, particularly at the federal level, is close to dysfunctional.

On a world level, I’d put at the top of the list two more issues:

1. Global warming and the fact that we’re not fully ready for its consequences;

2. The fact that while you and I are conversing via email, more than a billion people still live in poverty.

In general, though, I’m optimistic that we’ll slowly resolve these challenges — because, as I said earlier, that’s been the trajectory over time.

Niaz: Dan, thanks again for giving us time in the midst of your busy schedule and sharing us your invaluable ideas.

Dan Pink: You’re welcome Niaz.

_  _  _  _  ___  _  _  _  _

Further Reading:

01. Philip Kotler on Marketing for Better World

02. Hugh Mac­Leod on Creativity and Art

03. Philip Delves Broughton on What they teach you at Harvard?

04. Naeem Zafar on Entrepreneurship for the Better World

05. Derek Sivers on  Entrepreneurship, CD Baby and Wood Egg

06. Jeff Haden on Pursuing Excellence

07. Rita McGrath on Strategy in Volatile and Uncertain Environments

08. Gautam Mukunda on Leadership

09. Gerd Leonhard on Big Data and the Future of Media, Marketing and Technology

Philip Kotler: Marketing for Better World

Editor’s Note: Professor Dr. Philip Kotler is the S.C. Johnson & Son Professor of International Marketing at the Kellogg School of Management, Northwestern University, Evanston, Illinois. He has been honored as one of the world’s Leading Marketing Thinkers. He received his Master’s Degree at the University of Chicago and his PhD Degree at MIT, both in Economics. He did post-doctoral work in Mathematics at Harvard University and in Behavioral Science at the University of Chicago.

Professor Kotler is the author of several bestselling books including Marketing Management: Analysis, Planning, Implementation and Control. It is the most widely used marketing book in graduate business schools worldwide. He has published over one hundred articles in leading journals, several of which have received best-article awards.

He has been a consultant to IBM, General Electric, Sony, AT&T, Bank of America, Merck, Motorola, Ford, and others. The Financial Times included him in its list of the top 10 Business Thinkers.

You can read his full bio from here, here, here, here and here.

eTalk’s Niaz Uddin has interviewed Philip Kotler recently to gain insights about his ideas, research and works in the field of marketing and creating better world.

Niaz: Dear Kotler, thank you so much for joining us. We are delighted and honored to have you at eTalks.

Philip Kotler:  Niaz, thank you for having me.

Niaz: You are an economist trained at the University of Chicago (M.A.) and MIT (Ph.D.). Three of your Professors were Nobel Prize Economists – Milton Friedman, Paul Samuelson, and Robert Solow. But you have been cited as the world’s foremost expert on the Strategic Practice of Marketing. Can you please tell us a little bit about yourself and why marketing became such a big factor in your life?

Philip Kotler:  Throughout my study of economic theory, I was bothered by the absence of discussions of distribution institutions (wholesalers, retailers, agents, jobbers, etc.) and promotional tools (advertising, sales promotion, and salesforce).  It seemed to me that the level of market demand and individual company demand are heavily influenced by these institutions and activities as well as price (which absorbed the most attention of economists).  When I was offered a position to teach either economics or marketing at the Kellogg School of Management at Northwestern University, I chose to teach marketing so that I could show that it was a branch of economic science.

I moved into the question of what influences the level, composition and timing of customer demand and what are the determinants of individual demand.  Classic economics assumes a world of rational buyers and rational producers.  I always felt that this grossly oversimplified the understanding of customer behavior and producer behavior.  The recent growth of interest in behavioral economics in contrast to classical economics is bringing many missing institutions and activities into economic focus.

Niaz: So how do you define Marketing?

Philip Kotler: The shortest definition of marketing is “Finding needs and filling them profitably.”  However, I would rather cite the American Marketing Association’s definition that says “Marketing is the activity, set of institutions, and processes for creating, communicating, delivering, and exchanging offerings that have value for consumers, clients, partners, and society at large.”  (American Marketing Association, 2008)

Niaz: In this hyper competitive era, what do you think about the Position of Marketing in Total Business Operation? How can marketing change the entire game plan?

Philip Kotler:  In spite of the fact that marketing is now headed by a Chief Marketing Officer (CMO) who presumably participates in the company’s strategy development, I find in many companies that the CMO is not invited or expected to be an active participant in strategy development.  It’s as if senior management wants the CMO to continue managing the marketing work without interfering with long range strategic planning.

The irony is that the CMO is the person in the company who is closest to the changing marketplace and is in the best position to spot new opportunities for the company.  Because the CMO is probably going to have a left brand (analytical) and a right brain (creative), CMOs are more likely to work as game changers during the planning process.  We expect CMOs to have a very deep understanding of customers, competitors, distributors, and suppliers.

If I ran a company, I would want my Chief Marketing Officer (CMO) to be modeled on Steve Jobs and come up with big, new ideas and also be modeled on Bill Gates with a deep grasp of business analytics.

Niaz: Your Marketing Management book is in its 14th edition and is used in most MBA Marketing courses worldwide. A certified classic, the book has ranked among the Top 200 Titles on Amazon.com and been named among the 50 Best Business Books of All Time by Financial Times. You published the first edition of this book around 46 years ago. So what are the revolutionary changes has occurred by this time in our society?

Philip Kotler: During this period, I have witnessed a lot of changes in the marketplace and I have managed to portray them in each new edition of Marketing Management, now in the 14th edition.  My editions helped emphasize the need to adopt a customer orientation; to precede the 4Ps with segmentation, targeting and positioning (STP); to move into higher mathematics and better marketing metrics to show accountability; to emphasize the social responsibilities of marketing; to broaden marketing to cover the marketing of places, people, and ideas; to recognize the importance of relationship marketing over transaction marketing; and to recognize the revolutionary power of digital and social marketing.  My next edition will enlarge on some new trends such as co-creation, crowdsourcing, sustainability, dynamic pricing, digital marketing, marketing automation, and growth strategies.

Niaz: What are the biggest shifts you see happening among consumer attitudes and behaviors right now and how is technology influencing this?

Philip Kotler:  Consumers are worried about the future and their ability to keep their job and hopefully earn a good and growing income.  They see the high level of unemployment in the U.S. and Europe and see a growing number of industries – music, publishing, movies, retail book stores – being disrupted by online and digital marketing.  This leads consumers to save more and spend less which only increases the loss of jobs.  And companies see only two ways to compete, either by presenting a lower price to reach the mass market (Wal-Mart) or by presenting a higher price to reach the affluent (Gucci).  The middle is gone.

Niaz: How are those shifts affecting Marketing?

Philip Kotler:  The big problem facing companies today is how to grow in a low growth market. My answer is that marketers face more opportunities and hidden pockets of growth than they normally recognize.  I just published Market Your Way to Growth: Eight Ways to Win. There are eight chapters and each examines a specific pathway to growth.  I worry that companies get stuck in one strategy that is now showing diminishing returns and fail to shift in time to any of the other seven pathways to growth.

Niaz: What kind of impact are the Internet, Social Media and other Advances in Communications Technology having on marketing?

Philip Kotler:  The Internet is having an impact today that is comparable to what the world felt when Gutenberg introduced the idea of printing.  The Internet, social media and new communication technologies are major game changers in marketing.  No longer does the company own its brand by having a monopoly on communications about their brands.  It is the consumers and their peer-to-peer talk that is shaping our images of brands and what to buy and how much to pay.  Furthermore, no company can afford to deceive customers without being quickly exposed on the Internet.

Niaz: Are the ‘four Ps’ still a useful framework?

Philip Kotler:  Yes.  Please appreciate that the 4Ps are the basis of a marketing plan.  Any respectable marketing plan must discuss the company’s decisions on Product, Price, Place and Promotion. If the company wants to add some other things, they are either already implied in the four Ps or could be added.  For example, services are part of the product, and sales force is part of promotion.  Packaging is part of the product.  Recently Professor Jagdish Sheth introduced the four A’s – Availability, Affordability, Acceptability, and Awareness – but I see the 4As not as a competitor but a useful complement that precedes the setting of the 4Ps. The 4As identify the consumer conditions that should be satisfied and it is the job of the 4Ps to follow upon the 4As.

Niaz: What do you see the role of technology being in the new marketing mix?

Philip Kotler:  New technologies affect all of the 4Ps. The advent of 3D Printing will help entrepreneurs design new products cheaper and faster.  The development of software to do dynamic pricing will allow airlines to change the price of seats depending on the number of seats already sold. The development of new distribution channels such as online selling and eBay are increasing the ease of transacting.  The development of social media technologies such as Facebook, Twitter and YouTube are changing our tools for promotion.

Niaz: Well known marketers like Yvon Chouinard, the founder of Patagonia, believe that “traditional advertising is dead.” Is he correct or misled, and why?

Philip Kotler:  This statement makes a good headline but it is inaccurate.  Traditional advertising will continue in its role as brand builder but it will have to do it with a lower budget.  Some percentage of every advertising budget will have to move into digital and social media marketing.  Right now this may be 5 percent, then 10 percent, and conceivably in five or more years 50 percent.  The more correct statement of Yvon Chouinard would be that traditional advertising will increasingly partner with digital marketing, one supporting the other in a synergistic way.

I will add one more thought about advertising.  What is most important in advertising is copy, not media.  The best media won’t make up for poor copy.  I don’t think advertising agencies come up with exceptional campaigns.  Of the last 10 campaigns that you saw, you are unlikely to be impressed with more than one.  Most campaigns simply lack originality and punch.  I prefer to hire three advertising agencies and pay them for three campaign ideas for the same product and then choose the best campaign idea and hire a separate media agency to develop the best media mix to carry the best of the three campaign ideas to the target audience.

Niaz: Let’s look at marketing in the future. What changes are going to occur within in next couple of decades?

Philip Kotler:  Here are four changes out of many:

1. Companies will increasingly invite customers to co-create products with the company.

2. Companies will increasingly resort to crowdsourcing to get ideas for new products, new advertising campaigns, and new sales promotion ideas.

3. Companies will increasingly move to marketing automation where they use artificial intelligence to carry out marketing activities that were formerly done by skilled marketers.

4. Companies will increasingly learn how to produce “lovemarks” with their customers and employees.

Niaz: What are the points that a CMO must remember now before setting marketing plan?

Philip Kotler:  The first need is to get each marketing planner to carefully define the target audience and deeply understand their needs and desires and the main triggers to purchase.  The aim should be to discover something new about that target audience, some new insight into their psyche that will cause them to want to take the offer.

Niaz: As you know Disruptive Innovation sometimes makes Customer Driven Company obsolete. In addition to giving most priority to customers, companies now need to focus on some other important factors like changing technological trend, innovation, market shifts and so on. Now, what are your suggestions for companies to set marketing plans in order to save their companies from getting obsolete for Disruptive Innovation?

Philip Kotler:  Every company and industry is in danger of disruption.  The choice facing a company is whether to be disrupted or be the disrupter.  I would advise a company to run a meeting ever so often to consider everything that might disrupt the company, whether it is a new technology, a shift in consumer tastes or their pocketbook, etc.

Each possible disruption needs to be assessed for its severity and its probability of happening.  A serious probable disruption poses the following choice.  Either sell the business now before it loses its value due to the imminent disruption, or invest in the disruption to replace your business and become the disrupter.

Niaz: How can marketing help Startups to survive in front of giant competitors like Google, Facebook, Amazon and Apple?

Philip Kotler:  Many entrepreneurs precisely try to take a bite out of a giant competitor.  Right now, several companies are trying to hit Google by setting up a more focused search system.   Their aim is not to slay Google so much as ironically to sell out to Google.  Giant companies are well prepared to buy up any company that carries a disruptive potential and either bury it on the shelf or expand it into another business opportunity.

Niaz: What are the secrets of revolutionary marketing?

Philip Kotler:  I don’t use the term revolutionary marketing.  You might mean Guerrilla Marketing whereby a small company attacks a giant firm on a hit and miss basis.  Or do you mean a company that will create a paradigm change?  For example, Tom’s shoes has proven that online selling of shoes works.  Tom’s offers to send three different sizes of the same shoe, expecting the customer to buy the best fit and return the other two pairs.  In addition, Tom says that it will give a free pair of shoes to a poor person for every pair sold to a customer.  This principle is now adopted by a new eye glass company that will send several glass frames by mail from which the customer makes a choice, and in addition the company will supply a free pair of glasses to a poor person who can’t afford to pay.

Niaz: One of your recent books is Chaotics. Can you please give us a brief of ‘Chaotics’?

Philip Kotler:  John Caslione and I wrote Chaotics right after the financial crash that took place in 2007 to caution companies against making the wrong responses to the crisis.  Most companies wanted to cut their costs and lower their prices.  This is not always the most appropriate response in chaotic, turbulent times.  Some companies should actually increase their marketing spend and take advantage of the crisis.  Consider that some competitors are weakened more than your company and this is the time to attack, not withdraw.  This is the time to build your market share which in normal times cannot be moved a few points.  We discuss the appropriate decisions that companies in different situations need to make in their marketing, production, finance and other functions to take advantage of the turbulence.

Niaz: You have published the seminal article in 1971 coining the term “Social Marketing” in its original use. Can you please tell us about ‘Social Marketing’?

Philip Kotler:  Forty two years ago, Gerald Zaltman and I published “Social Marketing: An Approach to Planned Social Change” in the Journal of Marketing.  We felt that marketing science can apply to more than the marketing of goods and services.  Marketing can help in designing and promoting solutions to social problems, such as smoking, hard drugs, poverty, hunger, and others.  Marketing always starts with a customer analysis of the barriers and benefits that influence customer behavior. In the case of tobacco use, we need to distinguish the different segments of smokers and prepare a different 4P marketing campaign to help facilitate the decision to stop smoking.  We could have named this “cause marketing” but we chose to name it “social marketing” to imply that marketing has a social side, not just a commercial side.  Today there are thousands of social marketers trained in the basics of marketing and applying marketing to alleviate problems of poverty, hunger, poor nutrition, education, and health.  Recently the third World Social Marketing conference was held in Toronto, Canada with 600 attendees.

Niaz: You are the first recipient of the American Marketing Association Foundation’s “Marketing for a Better World” Award. Can you please tell us how can marketing be used to make this world a better place?

Philip Kotler:  We can create a better world through marketing in several ways.  Commercially, we can improve our products and services and find ways to lower their prices and costs.  Socially, we can work on specific social problems and reduce their severity through the application of social marketing.  Societally, we can assist companies in defining the areas where they can make charitable contributions and work with others to improve the quality of life.

Niaz: Is there a personal influence or anecdote from your own life that you can share regarding the attention you’ve given to solving social problems?

Philip Kotler:  When HIV/AIDs broke out as a major disease and took the lives of so many young adults, I developed a strategy for influencing young adults to avoid situations where they could contract AIDS.  It was important to avoid these situations and also get early testing if they might have contracted the disease.  I worked with the YMCA and other organizations to help them develop campaigns.  I didn’t think that straight education campaigns on the dangers of AIDS would be enough to demotivate certain behaviors.  Happily, modern medicines began to appear to help AIDS victims lead a longer life.

Niaz: Why do you think marketing is a great tool to change the world?

Philip Kotler:  Marketing’s starting point is with consumer well-being. Marketing is about the maximization of consumer well-being.  It also takes into account the well-being of employees, distributors,   suppliers, investors and other stakeholders. 

Niaz: How does Marketing can help us profoundly to change the world to make it a better place to live?

Philip Kotler:  There are at least three types of marketing that will contribute greatly to making the world a better place to live. 

1. Commercial marketing, in assisting companies to make better products and services for the poor, the middle class, and the affluent.

2. Social marketing, in assisting governments, nonprofit organizations and “caring” companies to influence more salutary behaviors such as better nutrition, regular exercise, desisting from smoking or using hard drugs, being environmental, etc.

3. Place marketing, in assisting cities, regions and nations to attract tourists and visitors and new residents and factories and retail chains so that life can be improved for all in those places.

Niaz: Thanks you so much for your invaluable time. All the best wishes for your good health and impressive works. We are grateful to have you at eTalks. Your ideas, knowledge and expertise are worth spreading. Thank you once again.

Philip Kotler:  You are welcome Niaz. I must compliment you on raising very good questions.

_  _  _  _  ___  _  _  _  _

Further Reading:

1. Derek Sivers on  Entrepreneurship, CD Baby and Wood Egg

2. F. M. Scherer on Industrial Economy, Digital Economy and Innovation

3. Stephen Walt on Global Development

4. Gautam Mukunda on Leadership

5. Rita McGrath on Strategy in Volatile and Uncertain Environments

6. Gerd Leonhard on Big Data and the Future of Media, Marketing and Technology